• BearOfaTime@lemm.ee
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      11 months ago

      Yep.

      I’ve already run into a few. I mentally thank them for preventing me from wasting my time and money with them.

      • deweydecibel@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Is this going to be the response every time this shit happens until we’re all just sitting on Lemmy twiddling our thumbs? The arrogance feels like it’s downplaying the seriousness of the problem, and it’s annoying to see it recited so much.

        In a lot of cases, you may not have a choice of using the site or not. In cases where you do have a choice, eventually most if not all the alternatives can do the same shit if it becomes normalized.

        API is letting these types of filter lists become shared easily, too. Sites may not even make a conscious decision to filter out proton, it may just happen because their filters are pulling from lists like this.

        The problem is the trend. And try as you may, you can not fully escape that.

        • Apollo2323@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          11 months ago

          Well sometimes those websites ask you to register because you are buying something so they will loose me as a customer. Also even if I complain most companies dont care about privacy so I prefer to use my wallet as a way for this companies to listen my voice.

        • asap@feddit.de
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          11 months ago

          Use a custom domain on Protonmail (which includes Simplelogin) and you won’t have any issues. It’s a grand total of $5 per year for the domain.

        • SuckMyWang@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          Use a temporary email every time you use the website. Clog their mailing lists full of garbage. Make their metrics lie to them

    • catastrophicblues@lemmy.ca
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      11 months ago

      Same. That said, sometimes it’s a config error. I sent a very annoyed email to a website that didn’t work on Firefox, only for them to tell me that it was a bug and that they fixed it.

    • Redjard@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      11 months ago

      And since people won’t use the website, the website won’t use the list. So the list would be useless.
      The maintainer seems to have followed the same interpretation, weighing legitimate use against spam use. This is the official response to the issue as of 8h ago:

      Dear Contributors,

      We value your suggestions for expanding our list of disposable email providers. Your input is crucial in enhancing our tool’s capabilities.

      Decision on Gmail and ProtonMail Inclusion

      After thorough evaluation, we have resolved not to include Gmail and ProtonMail in our list. Our rationale is based on the following technical and operational considerations:

      1. **Reputation and Reliability**
         
         * **Gmail and ProtonMail**: Established, reputable providers with a high trust level for personal and professional communication.
         * **Distinction**: Unlike typical disposable email services, they offer long-term, reliable email solutions.
      
      2. **Active Abuse and Spam Prevention Mechanisms**
         
         * **Effective Systems**: Both providers have robust mechanisms to detect and mitigate abuse and spam.
         * **Proactive Monitoring**: Ensures a secure email environment, reducing the prevalence of malicious activities.
      
      3. **Commercial Intent of Typical Disposable Email Providers**
         
         * **Focus**: Targeting providers driven by ad revenue, facilitating spam/abuse.
         * **Gmail and ProtonMail's Model**: User-centric, not primarily ad-driven.
      
      4. **Domain Limitations**
         
         * **Effectiveness**: Limited domain offerings by Gmail and ProtonMail make them less susceptible to misuse.
         * **Strategy**: Focusing on providers with extensive, rotating domain lists for more impactful filtering.
      
      5. **Individual User Accountability**
         
         * **Accountability Measures**: Both services have mechanisms to penalize users violating terms, decreasing misuse risks.
      

      Summary and Next Steps

      Including Gmail and ProtonMail does not align with our criteria for identifying disposable email services. Our aim is to target services significantly contributing to online spam and abuse, without impacting legitimate email services. We have reviewed your list and agree on adding some providers, like internxt.com (Reference). We will also incorporate the obvious choices from the tail of your list. We apologize for the delay in addressing this issue but intend to promptly resolve it by focusing on the most impactful additions.

    • Stantana@lemmy.sambands.net
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      11 months ago

      Simple as, if they don’t even support e-mail it’s surely a rather shite site.

      The closed garden corpo-approved electronic message service the github issue is talking about simply won’t do.

  • micka190@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    Damn, that guy’s fucking dumb lmao

    But also, is 7c/fakefilter even popular? It seems to barely have a following on GitHub to begin with. Seems pretty over the top to claim that PM and SL (and any other provider on that list) will get blocked from registering on websites.

  • tabular@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    Sick of sites requiring an account, email or phone number. Makes the web even more unfriendly. I hope temporary emails can always get around filters, as if you play stupid games you should win stupid prices.

    • driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br
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      11 months ago

      I was in a club and had to open an account to open a tab, they asked me for my government number ID, pretty standard, but then they started asking for phone number, age, email, Instagram account and I was like wtf, I just want a bottle of water!

      • Senshi@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Where do you live that providing your government id to a business is standard? In Germany, the only one outside of a judge to be allowed to request that is law enforcement ( even then only with proper cause ). Of course, some businesses are legally required to request and process your ID number ( e.g. when booking international flights, medical insurance companies etc), but these are under tight federal control and supervision to ensure data safety.

        Age verification sometimes is a thing for purchasing 18+ things ( media or drugs like alcohol & smokes), but even then businesses will only ever perform a visual check of the date of birth on your ID. Technically they can never demand to hold your ID, not even for a short time just to better read the date. You only have to show them your ID. And actually recording and/or storing any of that information would be insanely illegal.

        Germany / Europe might have its issues, but we at least try and take our freedom and data privacy serious. I would never dream of handing my ID to a generic business like a club for anything more than the age check.

        • driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br
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          11 months ago

          It’s in Brazil and is pretty standard. There’s different IDs here, the most common one is called CPF and is used for financial transactions, is the number that identify you with the tax agency. In some things you can denied it, like in the pharmacy, but in other ones not, like buying a TV or car.

          • Senshi@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            Interesting, will have to read up on how that works in Brazil. We also have a separate tax id here ( which is also used for pension and social security ), but that one is even more secure/private than the passport ID. We only provide that to our chosen medical insurance provider ( bc they need to register it with the ministry of finance ) as well as employers ( because 50% of the insurance has to be paid by employers).

            It’s explicitly not allowed and intended for generic identification purposes, because it makes it too accessible for identity theft and associated scams.

        • pixeltree@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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          11 months ago

          If you’re ordering alcohol, completely ordinary

          Or maybe that’s what you were saying and I missed the sarcasm, idk

          • NotSteve_@lemmy.ca
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            11 months ago

            Is it ordinary for them to request the ID number? I’m Canada they just do a quick glance at the birth date on your ID

    • 𝐘Ⓞz҉@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      Just keep using the temp emails and when they don’t recieve your email , call them up. Their IT support will unblock it after 50-100 calls. Remember consumers have the power.

    • uranibaba@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      I tried to report an issue in GitLab. I needed to input my phone number and payment information to create an account. WTF? No thanks, I’ll just not report the issue.

      • tabular@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        do you guys not have phones

        When buying stuff online I find 0101etc works. Public numbers used to work fine for other things but not so much these days. If that doesn’t work I usually don’t give a damn about the service at that point (e.g. ShatGPT) #TeamBots

        • uranibaba@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          I used to have a disposable phone number just for signing up but it was more trouble then it was worth. If the website is shady enough, I go look somewhere else.

    • Syrc@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      Sick of sites requiring an account, email or phone number.

      Blame bots. The other day we had a post about how 70% of account creation processes on sites are started by bots. Imagine that if you didn’t even need confirmation.

      • tabular@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        What if account creation was local (e.g. Git and keys)?

        If no data needs to be stored then no account is needed. Use the system where there is a unique indentifier based on the password.

        • Syrc@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          Use the system where there is a unique indentifier based on the password.

          Never heard of this, how does that work?

          • tabular@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            A tripcode "is the hashed result of a password that allows one’s identity to be recognized without storing any data about users. Entering a particular password will let one “sign” one’s posts with the tripcode generated from that password. Trying to take another user’s tripcode and compute their password from it (for instance, to make posts that appear to come from a particular person) is somewhat computationally difficult."

            • Syrc@lemmy.world
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              11 months ago

              That’s pretty cool, but still, does that really solve the bot problem? Doesn’t it make it easier for them to spam?

              • tabular@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                Tripcodes doesn’t affect bots spamming at all.

                No longer needing accounts removes whatever barrier to entry email, phone or credit card is worth. On the plus side less people are being farmed for data, so society is better off 😕

                • Syrc@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  What I mean is, doesn’t that barrier being removed make things easier for bots as well? And while humans only save a bit of time once to register, bot farms would improve a lot considering they do it over and over again.

                  Less data farming is undeniably better, but imo if something helps bringing us further from the Dead Internet outcome I can accept it. Of course, just the bare necessities, sites that require you mail + phone + name and so on when they don’t need them to function should really dial it down.

  • sir_reginald@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    the discussion is happening here: https://github.com/7c/fakefilter/issues/73

    Someone working at Proton has commented on the issue, the list maintainer wanted to take the discussion with proton private so we have only a few posts from them.

    If you want my personal take:

    It’s very clear how the list maintainer opposes anonymity in the internet in any form, which I see as an attack on freedom, journalism and activism.

    I’m not a fan of Protonmail of any sort and in fact I consider that their privacy is lacking… but I really hope they can talk some sense into this guy. This block list seems to be used by a lot of webs that will start blocking virtually every private email provider.

    (Edit: I assumed the person that posted the email list was a maintainer, but they don’t seem to have a “contributor” or “owner” badge, so idk. Maybe they are just very angry at privacy and anonymity on the internet)

  • Sockenklaus@sh.itjust.works
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    11 months ago

    Am I the one one thinking this post is blowing the topic way out of proportion?

    The post title is clickbait in its purest form: nothing is being blocked (from what even). There is a single issue raised on some obscure filter list… This has no consequences whatsoever. I am wondering why Protonmail even bothers to comment on this issue…

    • SBJ@sh.itjust.works
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      11 months ago

      Admittedly the title is pretty sensationalist. The repo activity seems to indicate that the project has some users. It’s impossible to know how many sites or which sites block emails contained in this list and what the impact might be. Even though I think the 7c/fakefilter project is inane, I would hesitate to say there would be no consequences at all.

      It’s best to defend legitimate email providers whenever possible. If we don’t, those with an axe to grind get to define the provider’s reputation.

  • ransomwarelettuce@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    OK simplelogin you can make an argument there, very stupid one though.

    But protonmail and tutanota, wtf ?!?

    Just because an email provider is privacy focused and offers custom aliases means all it’s emails are spam ?

    Fuck this shit.

  • helpmyusernamewontfi@lemmy.today
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    11 months ago

    Honestly, the more these one time accounts try to convince me to remove protonmail and simplelogin, the more I see how much it’s needed to block them. It’s like the marketing team is desperately trying to keep their services from being rightfully flagged and it just makes me want to block them even more. I do hope they won’t cloud your judgement @7c , as these services are used for temp emails by all definitions. If you have any questions you may always ask me from the conversation we have started :)

    Shit like this is what makes me want to pull my hair out at night

      • JGrffn@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        He’s such a manchild, it’s unbelievable. Won’t budge when talked to in a friendly manner, will lash out if someone else calls him out, and will continue to complain in responses to civil people, saying nobody is being civil and whatnot, just for the sake of adding fuel to the fire. He got sat the fuck down by the repo owner, and the schadenfreude is fucking delicious.

  • Zak@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    It appears that the Github user GalacticHypernova is not a contributor to the 7c/fakefilter project - just someone asking for some domains to be added. The current list does not contain proton.me or protonmail.com.

    I suppose this might be a reasonable litmus test for the reliability of that list.

  • AMDIsOurLord@lemmy.ml
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    11 months ago

    The one who opened an issue is either 13 years old and dumb as a log or a troll (also dumb as a log) and this project is barely used, like at all

    So please, don’t give them attention

    • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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      11 months ago

      That comment chain was utterly hilarious. The OP practically wanted to block every email provider in existence.

      You know because you can create spam from practically every provider. I guess it’s good that this kind of idiocy is hashed out rather than just being implemented blindly with a pull request.

      • JGrffn@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        And once he got sat the fuck down, he wanted to continue discussing the topic “privately, away from the toxicity”, going full out Wormtongue. Fuck him.

      • Pazuzu@midwest.social
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        11 months ago

        Stop all spam with this one simple trick filter! All spam emails contain ‘@’, therefore all emails containing ‘@’ are spam and will be blocked

    • Karyoplasma@discuss.tchncs.de
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      11 months ago

      You cannot even make it past the half-way mark of the OP to realize that the creator has no idea what they are talking about.

      Something interesting I learnt about the generated gmail accounts is that they either contain + or an excessive amount of dots, 2 very odd patterns in real, legitimate email accounts. I was able to reliably detect at least 3 or 4 dots in the email itself when it’s using the dotted variation.

      Continuing the discussion, the fact that they are so defensive and immediately hide behind moral high ground when someone calls out their mental gymnastics out for the bullshit they are, makes me believe that they are a troll. A child would lose interest after getting so many negative responses.


      The behavior you see from the creator is close to a troll tactic called “sealioning”. While refusing to give their own claims any plausible proof (they constantly talk about “tests” they’ve run without any specification thereof), they request elucidation or sources for any contraindicating claims (here in the form of discussions which are held off-platform, e.g. on Discord), but fail to engage with any proof of the contrary (refusing to take protonmail and several other legitimate providers off the list even after talking to the literal CTO) while just reiterating their standpoint over and over again.

      All the while, they pretend to discuss sincerely and are always polite and superficially receptive to counterclaims. This is key to their general strategy of eroding a victim’s patience and exhaust their attention. One of two outcomes generally occur:

      a) The victim snaps. In this case the troll will claim moral high ground and garner sympathy from 3rd-party observers because of fickle reasons like “there is no reason to insult somebody on the internet”.

      b) The victim leaves in order to not appear unreasonable. On a public platform, like a thread, many observers will then grant the “victory” to the troll because their stand point seems strong and counterclaims seem indefensible. This is the ultimate goal of the troll and what makes it dangerous.

      • Goferking0@ttrpg.network
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        11 months ago

        Just reminds me of an idiot PM we had who after realizing you could do the + thing on Gmail addresses made the devs block it, then didn’t understand why qa and anyone else testing using those types of email accounts got mad when no one could get in or create new accounts

  • kia@lemmy.ca
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    11 months ago

    Why does anyone care? The npm package has 3,712 weekly downloads. They’re trying to act like it’s some mainstream package that a lot of companies rely on, but nobody uses it…

  • DLSantini@lemmy.ml
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    11 months ago

    Funny, considering I’ve moved over to a paid proton account as my primary email, and my former primary email/Gmail account, with its ability to instantly become infinitely many disposable email addresses, is now used as exactly that. This same procedure occured many years ago, when I made my yahoo email into the disposable junk mail home, and my shiny new Gmail became my primary. I wonder how many years it be until proton becomes my disposable, and some as-of-yet to be created service becomes my new primary email. Or maybe email will finally be dead by then, and we’ll use something else entirely.

    I will say, even after all of these years, and using the living shit out of my Gmail account in many, many places, I still only get two or three spam emails at most during the entire year.