You’re combining disparate groups of people using arguments against things they aren’t bringing up, and deliberately missing the points brought up.
The people who tell you that the USSR wasn’t true Communism are correct, it never reached there. By deliberately using wrong terminology, you prove a lack of intention to actually talk to Socialists. Don’t say “Communism failed,” say that Socialist countries have failed to react Communism. Then you may have an actual convo. People don’t usually reject the USSR being Socialist, they just point out how you’re using wrong terminology, correctly.
Additionally, it is absolutely not the same to say Capitalism inevitably fails. The people who say that do so by analyzing the mechanics of Capitalism, not by vaguely gesturing at fallen Capitalist states and assuming means from ends to fit their narrative. Analyze the fall of the USSR, there’s a ton that went wrong that can be learned from, but none of it was because tools turn people evil if they collectively own them. There’s no mysticism to tools, people can collectively own them without issue, it’s all a matter of how. Worker co-operatives prove this, they are more stable and have higher rates of employee satisfaction. Same with public programs like single payer Healthcare, or housing initiatives like in Red Vienna.
Finally, for this meme. The Conquest of Bread is a book by Anarcho-Communist Pyotr Kropotkin. The image is a well-known and widely-shared meme, with the Hammer and Sickle all, but the changes made by OP indicate this is supposed to be from an Anarchist perspective, not Marxist-Leninist like the USSR. You’re arguing against ghosts that aren’t here.
Please, if you want to say anything of value, start by using correct terminology. You’ll get farther.
Right, because you know what people told me, and I don’t. I must never have had these conversations because they’re not what you want to bring up.
Coupling that with ‘don’t use wrong terminology you didn’t use’ is illustrative.
none of it was because tools turn people evil if they collectively own them.
Oh is that all you’re proposing? Is it? Is it, though? Is it really? No further details that might be relevant?
Do you not feel the slightest tug of cognitive dissonance, scolding someone for not inferring the exact sub-branch they’re allowed to critique, in a one-sentence joke?
You explained yourself, you were complaining about ghosts who claimed the USSR wasn’t a true attempt at Communism using wrong terminology, calling it Communism, when this is an Anarchist post.
I’m proposing that tools don’t turn people evil if they share them, yes. You haven’t done any analysis thay we can discuss here yet, and so far you’ve alluded that your only reasoning against leftism is that some Socialist states have fallen.
If you decide to say something relevant that we can discuss, I’m down! But you have to start somewhere, and you haven’t yet.
Yeah why would a joke concern a related topic instead of absolutely precisely exactly what’s right there in the text, and by in-the-text I mean the fact there’s no text?
Nobody ever jokes about things unless they’re categorically opposed.
Obviously a meme community should be deadly serious, for scholarly discourse, and also nuh-uh nobody oversteps your position or misuses your rhetoric, never ever. A ghost did it!
It’s not related, it was just a poor, incorrect jab at leftism on a leftist community, rather than something relevant. It wasn’t even funny, so that doesn’t save it either.
You’re combining disparate groups of people using arguments against things they aren’t bringing up, and deliberately missing the points brought up.
The people who tell you that the USSR wasn’t true Communism are correct, it never reached there. By deliberately using wrong terminology, you prove a lack of intention to actually talk to Socialists. Don’t say “Communism failed,” say that Socialist countries have failed to react Communism. Then you may have an actual convo. People don’t usually reject the USSR being Socialist, they just point out how you’re using wrong terminology, correctly.
Additionally, it is absolutely not the same to say Capitalism inevitably fails. The people who say that do so by analyzing the mechanics of Capitalism, not by vaguely gesturing at fallen Capitalist states and assuming means from ends to fit their narrative. Analyze the fall of the USSR, there’s a ton that went wrong that can be learned from, but none of it was because tools turn people evil if they collectively own them. There’s no mysticism to tools, people can collectively own them without issue, it’s all a matter of how. Worker co-operatives prove this, they are more stable and have higher rates of employee satisfaction. Same with public programs like single payer Healthcare, or housing initiatives like in Red Vienna.
Finally, for this meme. The Conquest of Bread is a book by Anarcho-Communist Pyotr Kropotkin. The image is a well-known and widely-shared meme, with the Hammer and Sickle all, but the changes made by OP indicate this is supposed to be from an Anarchist perspective, not Marxist-Leninist like the USSR. You’re arguing against ghosts that aren’t here.
Please, if you want to say anything of value, start by using correct terminology. You’ll get farther.
Right, because you know what people told me, and I don’t. I must never have had these conversations because they’re not what you want to bring up.
Coupling that with ‘don’t use wrong terminology you didn’t use’ is illustrative.
Oh is that all you’re proposing? Is it? Is it, though? Is it really? No further details that might be relevant?
Do you not feel the slightest tug of cognitive dissonance, scolding someone for not inferring the exact sub-branch they’re allowed to critique, in a one-sentence joke?
You explained yourself, you were complaining about ghosts who claimed the USSR wasn’t a true attempt at Communism using wrong terminology, calling it Communism, when this is an Anarchist post.
I’m proposing that tools don’t turn people evil if they share them, yes. You haven’t done any analysis thay we can discuss here yet, and so far you’ve alluded that your only reasoning against leftism is that some Socialist states have fallen.
If you decide to say something relevant that we can discuss, I’m down! But you have to start somewhere, and you haven’t yet.
I described conversations I’ve had and your hot take is ‘no you didn’t.’
If what I say doesn’t matter then you can find someone else to project at.
Your initial comment:
“There is no equivalent data for the second image, because ‘communism has never been tried.’”
This is an Anarchist meme, as we’ve proven
Nobody here has said thay Communism hasn’t been tried
The only thing leftists generally say is that the USSR never reached Communism
Anarchists love to point to Revolutionary Catalonia as a good example of Anarcho-Communism, and wouldn’t say it hadn’t been tried
Conclusion: you’re arguing with ghosts that don’t exist here for no other reason than to generally be anti-leftist.
Yeah why would a joke concern a related topic instead of absolutely precisely exactly what’s right there in the text, and by in-the-text I mean the fact there’s no text?
Nobody ever jokes about things unless they’re categorically opposed.
Obviously a meme community should be deadly serious, for scholarly discourse, and also nuh-uh nobody oversteps your position or misuses your rhetoric, never ever. A ghost did it!
Yeesh.
It’s not related, it was just a poor, incorrect jab at leftism on a leftist community, rather than something relevant. It wasn’t even funny, so that doesn’t save it either.
Whether or not you find it amusing, I really don’t think you know how jokes work.
-meme makes an Anarchist joke about bread prices
-you come in and say “hehe, Commie ghosts hypocritical”
Where was the humor? Mind elaborating for my feeble mind?